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Alleged defenders...?
Sawubona


Joined: 09 Nov 2005
Posts: 1179
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A Newbie would like to know if the following were at Rorke's Drift during the conflict that day and night:
1) Rev. Smith-- There seem to be some who say "No!". Why is there any mystery about him? Well, was he there or not?
2) Addendorf-- Maybe the Devil just made me throw his name in to make some of the denizens of this forum roll their eyes in self-righteous wonderment at my ignorance and yet welcome the opportunity to pontificate. Have at it!
3) "Pip"-- PETA wants to know (LOL). Seriously, was he there? And did he belong to Charlie Pope or Godwin-Austin in the first place and why was he (or was he not) on loan to Rorke's Drift? RG gives him an awful lot of credit to him for the defense during the night, but I've also heard the whole story and the portraits (both the painting and the photo) are apocryphal.
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Dawn


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 610
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
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I've been a newbie since June this year and know that these have been done before, however, here goes.

1. Rev Smith
I quote from Chard's report:
"The Reverend George Smith, Vicar of Estcourt, Natal, went for a walk...Mr Witt went with him...He came running down the hill...Mr Witt rode off...Mr Smith, however, elected to remain with us and during the attack did good service in supplying the men with ammunition."

2. Adendorff
Was he, wasn't he? Chard mentions him arriving at RD with the news of the attack on the camp, then goes on to mention him again at about the time of the torching of the hospital viz. "one man was shot, I believe by Lt Adendorff" Draw your own conclusions.

3. Pip, ah, Pip, haven't I been down this road before? Go to the old forum and in the search put "Pip" and see what comes up. Also in this new forum (can't remember the title) which I posted and got totally confused between the two Godwin-Austen brothers. Traditionally Pip belonged to Alfred Godwin-Austen and was adopted by Surgeon Reynolds when Alfred was invalided home. However, taken by some to be something of a legend that grew in the telling of it.

Hope I have been of some help.

Dawn
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Peter Ewart


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 1797
Location: Near Canterbury, Kent, England.
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Sawubona/Dawn

Yes, all the above three points have been covered in detail before on this forum (the previous version, which is still accessible & has a search facility), the 2nd and 3rd topics several times, although I think a lengthy Adendorff thread was lost in last year's unfortunate crash.

There is not one scintilla of doubt that Smith was there. His presence and actions are not only described in detail by a number of eye-witnesses including Chard, but he wrote his own lengthy first-hand account(s) and, indeed, only Chard's two written accounts are equal in length & detail to that left by Smith. His presence at the post & his (limited) part in its defence completely changed Smith's life. Lloyd's "Zulu War" (1979) inexplicably denied that Smith was there & I have ruminated on the possible reasons for his faux pas on the "old" forum. I'm not aware of any other "claim" that he wasn't there.

Adendorff - well, those who have examined the primary sources and considered all things which are relevant seem to be in general agreement on this forum that he was certainly there and that no doubt should ever have been raised in the first place. This is not to say that everyone concurs, including one or two who have gone into print. JW & JY are in no doubt that he was the only man known to have been involved in both battles that day. (No suggestion has ever surfaced that he was also at Inyezane, that I know of!). Laughing

As for "Pip" - well, there may have been a number of dogs at R/Drift. I think Martin has revealed on the forum what the regimental sources say about this topic. Morris has been accused (as in other matters!) of using a bit of licence here, but this story will always be a bit vague.

For the most reliable up-to-date work on who was there and who was not, see JW's and Lee Stevenson's works.

Peter Laughing Laughing
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Peter Ewart


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 1797
Location: Near Canterbury, Kent, England.
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These "emoticons" (what a word!) are cleverer than I thought! I don't remember telling them to laugh at my name, although it did take me three goes to get one of them in the right position ...

Peter
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Dawn


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 610
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
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Peter
Pesky little blighters, aren't they?

A bit like Pip, there one minute, gone the next and never listening to anything you tell them to do.

Dawn
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Sawubona


Joined: 09 Nov 2005
Posts: 1179
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Thanks for your responses! As you can see, I'm a new kid on the block and I apologize for beating horses that have already been laid to rest in past posts. Do you think you can stand this butcher's yard more than once?
My thoughts (such as they're worth): Pip:90/10 Yay (sp?); Addendorf:60/40 Nay; Smith: 70/30 Yay. Oh, Otto Witt, in spite of his claims, gets a no show! But that being said, what's the word on the street about how he and his wife both hear that the other had been slaughtered by the Zulu while escaping and then being reunited on the docks in Durban? Too good a story to be true?
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Joseph


Joined: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 14
Location: Atlanta GA USA
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Sawubona... are you saying by your Yays and Nays that you think Pip WAS there and Addendorf not? Maybe I misunderstood. It is my belief that Addendorf was there, Smith was there, and Pip is in doubt.
Joey

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Peter Ewart


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 1797
Location: Near Canterbury, Kent, England.
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Sawubona

What on earth is it that causes you to doubt that Smith was there? Do you think Chard was there? Bromhead? Hook? Hitch?

Smith was there, full stop. 100/0, to paraphrase your odds. Who or what (other than, perhaps, the author's error I mentioned above) has raised a doubt in your mind? You'll have to come up with something fairly explosive that no-one else has ever seen!

What is your reason for Adendorff's (not Addendorf's) probable absence, when eye-witnesses say he was there & remained?

I'm not sure "Pip" or any other animal matters that much, but as far as I understand the present situation, there is doubt about the identity or presence of only a very small handful (3 or 4?) of the 150/152 men present. Check the latest research by Whybra and Stevenson carefully & things will be much clearer in your mind.

Peter
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Gert Adendorff - Present
John Young


Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 982
Location: Lower Sheering, Essex
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Charles L. Norris-Newman records the following after his arrival at Rorke's Drift, on the morning of 23rd January 1879:
The following officers were also present at the post and rendered material aid in the defence: Dr. Reynolds, 1-24th, Lieutenant Adendorff, 1-3rd N.N.C., Messrs. Dunne, Dalton, and Byrne of the Commissariat Department, as also the Rev. Mr. Smith, Protestant Chaplain to No. 3 Column.


That's two of of your three laid to rest, sorry but he doesn't mention the dog, let alone its name.

John Y.
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Sawubona


Joined: 09 Nov 2005
Posts: 1179
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The image of the bear-like George Smith stalking around the perimeter and doling out fist fulls of ammunition, all the while loudly exhorting his comrades (no doubt in a suitably bear-like voice) sits well with me. And I confess that Loydd's (sp?) book probably is the source of the small seed of doubt of his participation. Pip's role is just too good a story to ignore, even if his name wasn't Pip--Doesn't everyone love a good heroic dog character LOL? Incidently, the story I heard of his eventual fate was Death by Taxicab in London (but I'm not sure I've the London part of the story correct),

That being said, IMHO, I appreciate that primary sources are (of course) the main grist for the researcher's mill, but they're not by their nature beyond question or doubt. An excellent case in point is the "evolution" over the years of Susanah Dickerson's account(s) of the Alamo. And Dealey Plaza (sp?) is tiny, but the accounts of the events on the day of Kennedy's shooting vary widely (or wildly) among the eye-witnesses to that tragic event. Even the wounded Gov. Connelly, a combat veteran and no stranger to gunfire, first swore he heard four gunshots and later changed his testimony to having heard only three. But I digress... I consider the adage about "The First Causalty of War" as being The Truth to be a disservice to most war correspondants. That said, how did Norris-Newman come by that list of names. I doubt he would recognize on sight a minor officer of the NNC, so was he personally introduced to Addendorf? Did Chard point him out or merely give Norris-Newman a list of the defenders? Or did Norris-Newman reconstruct a list at some later time from other sources? I don't know any of the details of Addendorf's court martial so some enlightenment would be appreciated, but his abandonment of his men to their fate on the saddle and escape "by way of the track" (which I understand as having been cut early in the battle and probably before the defense perimeter collapsed) certainly raises red flags in my mind. But I sincerely apologize to his memory for doubting him if I'm wrong.

Nit Pick Alert! "I believe by Lt. Addendorf" isn't near as unequivocal as "was shot by Lt. Addendorf", but we'll probably never know why there was some question in Chard's mind. Unless it's simply that he wasn't writing with the expectation that every phrase he put to paper would be so closely examined for "deeper meaning".

I'm just relying on the words of Morris for the fact Addendorf even was court martialed, but if so, can anyone provide more details about it? I'm sorry to be so contrary or (worse) generating redundancy, but Addendorf remains a shadowy figure to me.
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Sawubona


Joined: 09 Nov 2005
Posts: 1179
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Oh, sorry about the continued misspelling of "Addendorff". I'm sure that it's more apparent to most of you than it is to me that I can't spell worth a dam! Thanks for the correction, Peter.javascript:emoticon('Embarassed')
Embarassed
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Gert Adendorff's 'Court-Martial'
John Young


Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 982
Location: Lower Sheering, Essex
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Take a look through the old forum, his alleged accuser was an officer by the name of John Maxwell from 2nd Battalion, 3rd Regiment, N.N.C. A source identified in Morris' work as 'J.M.' His is the only source I can find relating to a Court-Martial.

Adendorff's presence at Rorke's Drift is also recorded by Lt. Henry Charles Harford, 99th Foot, a Special-Service Officer serving as the Adjutant of the 3rd Regiment, N.N.C. - again see past remarks on the old forum.

As to 'Noggs', I imagine he was introduced to Adendorff by an officer of the garrison, and being the correspondent that he was he would have recorded the information at the time.

'Shadowy' - no, not he, only in the minds of those who 'invent' facts relating to this campaign.

John Y.
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diagralex


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 208
Location: Broomfield, Essex
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It would appear that Norris-Newman did in fact recognise some of the local volunteers AND also probably had a list of defenders given to him. On reaching Helpmekaar he wrote
" I recognised several well known faces of the Carbineers, and learnt that some few of the survivors had gone on direct to Pietermaritzburg. It was with heartfelt pleasure that I was enabled to strike all these names out of the long official list of the missing which had been entrusted to me"
Obviously someone had hastily drawn up the necessary list(s)

Graham
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Mike Snook


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 130
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Noggs invited himself to become a member of the officers mess 3rd NNC. He camped with them, ate with them and so on. He would have known Adendorff.

Regards

Mike
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Pip/Bobbie
peterw


Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 865
Location: UK
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Sawubona

I think that you are confusing Pip's fate with that of Bobbie, who was wonded at the Battle of Maiwand with the 66th Foot. She returned to England only to be run over by a cab in Gosport.

http://www.thewardrobe.org.uk/search.php3?action=detail&period=0&category=0&keywords=Bobbie&logic=&offset=0

Peter
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Alleged defenders...?
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